Physics discussion

by **Zhol** on February 12th, 2015, 3:38 pm

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Hi guys/gals!

I'm going to be working on the Physics article. I want to make it as relevant and useful as I possibly can, so as well as covering basic premises and concepts, I want to make sure there's some "applied physics" in there as well, to help explain how physics can be applied to other skills - for example, how understanding ballistic arcs can help with archery, how understanding thermals is useful for wind eagle riders, how a pulley system is used as part of the rigging on a ship, etc.

I've had some helpful suggestions already; what would help even more is if people have thoughts/examples on the kind of physics concepts that a) they think it would be useful to have explained, and b) the kinds of physics concepts that Mizahar should not understand. For example, there definitely won't be much related to pressure and gas laws, because that's part of steam power (which isn't allowed on Miz); on the flipside, compasses and sighting lenses are available on the price list, so Mizahar must understand a little bit about optics and magnetism.

Also, any measuring devices and/or units of measurement you have used or seen used would be useful to know. When in doubt, I will be using imperial units (to match the price list).

I've included my outline so far below, and I'll be keeping it up to date as new suggestions come in.

Outline :

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by **Ayviss** on February 14th, 2015, 1:40 pm

Hey!

Physics… Ah, the nemesis of my life. I certainly will be glad when I've gone through it in my course.

Anyway, just adding my two cents to help:

Remember to try and keep it simple. Physics is a complex subject (for most, anyway), and even many adults don't have a good and correct understanding of it. So, in order to the skill writeup be accessible to anyone (and certainly make it easier to learn and implement in RP than if they had to search in outside sources), it needs to be kept simple, so my suggestion is not to use too many physics-specific terms.

Also, magnetism. It always goes together with electric, which is something very underdeveloped in Mizahar (we don't have electric light here, after all), but some electric phenomena are certainly something they have experienced, so they might have some knowledge on that. Just empirical stuff, nothing theoretical.

Which leads to my last point (for now. I've spent my summer learning physics, might as well put it to use). Some stuff are known empirically, even if not in theory. So even if Mizahar doesn't know much about gas laws, they certainly have experienced gas related phenomena and use it to their favor, despite not understanding and, thus, being able to get more out of it and make advances in those areas.

Make sure to outline the limitations of what PCs can and cannot "discover" or explore, and the reason for that.

Happy writing.

I hope that helped a little.

by **Zhol** on February 14th, 2015, 2:34 pm

I have three years of quantum and cosmological physics under my belt, so I feel you nemesis pain. :lol:

In terms of gas laws, I remember reading (during a discussion on the most effective way to propel a boat) that steam power was one of the things that was ruled out on Mizahar. That suggests that maybe Mizahar has never had any cause to invent pressure gauges (you only need pressure gauges if you are going to be dealing with pressures that might burst your pipes and valves), which makes it unlikely that they'd understand anything about the correlations between volume and pressure: no one has ever invented a device to measure it. They might understand that if you put too much air in a balloon, the balloon will burst... but that's not quite science yet. Philtering does show an understanding of evaporation and sublimation though, so I'll make sure to factor those in!

With electricity, it's worth bearing in mind that in the real world, it wasn't until 1873 that Maxwell sussed out that electricity and magnetism were linked. Up until then, they were regarded as two separate forces, and were understood independently. That said, you're right that some electric phenomenon will be familiar - I'll make sure to add in some stuff on lightning and static electricity and such.

And yeah - simple words and avoiding terminology is the aim of the game. "Light moves in straight lines" as opposed to any wave-particle duality nonsense, no mention of gravity, or any of that stuff. I definitely want to make it as "average Mizaharian" friendly as possible, else you'd have to be a physicist PC to make any kind of use of it. :lol:

Thanks for the help!

by **Aren** on February 15th, 2015, 8:15 pm

I'm wondering how you're planning to reconcile the supernatural elements that coexist or sometimes replace natural laws in Miz. For example, shadows. In the real world, shadows are created by the obstruction of light by an object, and that's all they are. In Miz, though, shadows are sentient. They can be talked to by someone with Akajia's mark, which means they're not quite what they are in the real world.

Another example is Djed. Res, for instance, can be manipulated absolutely while it's within the caster's zone of control, which means it can violate the laws of momentum as it can be stopped mid flight in an instant no matter how fast it's going or how much of it there is.

I don't know if you're going to tackle these kinds of issues, but I look forward to reading the write up nonetheless.

by **Ayviss** on February 16th, 2015, 12:26 pm

I think (but that's just a personal opinion, and I might be wrong) that magic is when you manage to break the laws of physics. But, in certain ways, they can obey the laws, too. Res can be stopped anytime, but maybe it requires more concentration/strength to stop a fast traveling Res than a slow traveling one.

Or maybe magic just plainly break some physics laws.

Anyway, that certainly is a very interesting point to touch on.

by **Zhol** on February 16th, 2015, 1:56 pm

As far as res and reimancy goes, my line of thought is that physics is the science of "physical stuff". If res doesn't obey the laws of physics, that means it's not "physical stuff" (which it isn't), and so it's outside the scope of the article. Like Ayviss says, magic is when you manage to break the laws of physics. It's also worth noting that in the reimancy article it talks about how, once you convert res into an element, it starts behaving as that element; the res becomes physical stuff when you change it, which fits with the assumption that it wasn't physical stuff beforehand.

With shadows, I don't think "what shadows are" necessarily enters into things. The article won't explain what fire is, or what light is, or what water is; it's an article about how the stuff behaves. If you think about it, sunlight comes from Syna; in the real world, the sun is a swirling ball of nuclear fusion, not a sexy blonde goddess... but the basics, the fact that light travels in a straight line, that Syna moves across the sky so you can use a shadow to tell the time, those are about the "behaviour" of lights and shadows, without getting into the philosophical/magical/etc reasons for things.

Think of it in terms of real world science/physics. Science can explain that thoughts are because of electrical impulses firing across your neurons, and happiness comes from the release of specific combinations of chemicals... science explains "how" you feel happy, but it doesn't explain "why" you're happy every time you watch a video of a slow loris reaching up to hug someone. How does fire/light/magnets behave, not why does it behave, etc.

At least, that's the line of logic I'm working with! Interesting point though - I'd forgotten about the Akajia mark, so I'll have to make sure I read up on that before I write the shadows section.